Last night, several friends and I traveled to Starbucks for some good coffee and conversation; we went to the one in Centerviille, and after we drank our coffee, we made our way to Krogers, standing beneath the awning, surrounded by all the hanging and potted plants. I told Dylan, "I feel like I'm in the Hanging Gardens of Babylon." We talked a lot about God, spirituality, that kind of stuff (nothing new), and the conversation turned to baptism. As I have been studying the Pauline epistles, my stance on baptism has been turning a new leaf. I'm not pro-baptism or no-baptism needed for salvation; rather, I say, "It is by faith that we are justified (made right in God's eyes), and it is in baptism that we are sanctified." I see baptism opening the door to the new life we can experience in Christ, while justification just gets us in the door of God's graces. So that's where I stand now.
I am beginning to realize I am a heretic. My views on the cross, salvation, heaven and hell, and the End Times are rather heretical to the people I am around. I don't think my views are wrong, I base them off of scripture, but I am a heretic because I cause division (sadly). At least I don't teach my "heresies" in class; rather, I keep them bottled up in notebooks. Hah.
I have always wanted to eat an artichoke, so I am fixing one now. Yay.
I am beginning to realize I am a heretic. My views on the cross, salvation, heaven and hell, and the End Times are rather heretical to the people I am around. I don't think my views are wrong, I base them off of scripture, but I am a heretic because I cause division (sadly). At least I don't teach my "heresies" in class; rather, I keep them bottled up in notebooks. Hah.
I have always wanted to eat an artichoke, so I am fixing one now. Yay.
9 comments:
I like your views. It makes ya think outside the box. Doesn't mean you're brainwashing us ;0). Challenge is always good, otherwise you become complacent (sp?) and never arrive at any kind of conclusion. Keep it up!
Did ya enjoy the arti?
Hmm baptism, I don't really know my own opinion about that. I'm actually a catholic so I've been baptised, but I don't know if it's really necessary. If there's a person who is not selfcomplacent, and he's not baptised, will he go to hell, just beacause he's not baptised? And does hell exists? Lots of questions which I would like an answer to.
No I didn't write that today, That happened about half a year ago, but today Brad said to me he still likes having those conversations with me and that he trusts me. :-)
A lot of people (especially where I go to school) think that if you're not baptized, you're going to hell. Frankly, I think that's a bunch of bullcrap. I don't see any reason NOT to be baptized, but there are examples in the scriptures (in particular the gospels) where people experience salvation apart from baptism. I DO think that baptism plays a big role in the work that God does on us, though. It's a heated topic, though, especially where I go to school.
As to hell, I am a heretic. I don't really believe in a hell of eternal torment. I think that people will suffer for their sins, though people such as Hitler will suffer a lot more (for obvious reasons), but not forever. I think, from what I've seen in the scriptures, that hell (eternal separation from God) refers more to the cessation of existence; in other words, those in hell simply do not exist anymore. Their punishment is non-existence, which sucks when compared to the alternative (existence in a new heavens and new earth, a beautiful paradise of love and laughter and friendship and happiness). So, yeah, my view on hell is heretical to a lot.
These are my views, though, so you don't havta believe them (most people disagree with me! hah).
Isaiah 66:24, Matthew 5:22 (talks about the fire of hell, if there was no hell, what is the fire all about?), 2 Peter 2:4, Revelation 14:10-11 (if you want straight up this reference is it). Take the Bible for what it is nothing less.
Now do you see why I am a heretic ;)
Just my two cents. Those Gospel references you mentioned...they are actually before the "New Covenant." Those situations where Jesus telss them that they are saved are before the redeeming power of the Cross, and the miracle of the Resurrection. We have to take chronology into account. What we see after the Crucifixion and Resurrection is a series of baptism as a part of the salvation process. Hearing the Message, blieving, the message, confessing the truth, repenting of our old ways, and being baptised into the New Covenant.
Read the Old Testament, God required a phyical sacrifice for a covenant to exist. Whether it be an animal, a piece of skin, or this new physical sacrifice of baptism, a covenant is not "validated" by believing in the covenant. A covenant is validated by believing AND acting on it.
I am not implying a "Saved by works" mentality. I am implying a "Faith that works" mentality.
Anyway i said i would give 2 cents, and it appears i gave 2 dollars.
Well, Mike, you know how my position on baptism changes every week :) as I spend more and more time contemplating it.
And I know you're not advocating "works-based-salvation;" technically speaking, baptism is a work of God, not a work of man, and the Greek word used for it does not imply work done by man (I forget, exactly, what the word is).
Well then I'm one of the persons who (partly) agrees with you.
But you do believe in sort of Hell and in Heaven. Don't you believe there's anything else after death?
Oh, I believe there's a LOT after death! If this were all there were to life, well, that is just entirely depressing.
I think that if a person belongs to God through Christ, he or she is given the gift of spending eternity with him and other Christians in a newly-created universe, where death and suffering and pain are gone, where it is paradise, a never-ending and enjoyable vacation where we do work we love and live lives of peace, tranquility, and happiness.
If a person doesn't belong to God through Christ, I believe he suffers for his rebellion against God (torment, but only for a time). After the person has suffered the due penalty of his crimes (as we would demand to happen from a God who is just!), he or she will be destroyed. It's not quite the happy ending. **As to torment, I don't think everyone suffers the same amount for the same amount of time; for instance, I am sure Hitler will suffer a lot more than the old man who just didn't care about God but lived a quiet life!
So that's what I think in regard to life-after-death. To be honest, sometimes I wish it were already here. It's just so exciting to think about, and even more exciting is that it is real.
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